Pacemaker Boats

leokow · Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2007 6:57 pm Post subject: Fuel Check ?

Has anyone checked their fuel yet, after the winter to see what kind of a state it is in . I know that before lay-up a lot of us were going to try different ways the combat the ethanol issue, different additives, empty tanks , full tanks. I would be very interested to see what kind of results different members have had regarding the choices they made,and I'm sure a lot of others would be interested too, as this is the first winter over for the new fuel mix.
Before lay-up the were numerous atricles about what to do , wether to leave tanks empty or full and what additives to use and not use. Right up till the last minute it was still hard to get a concensus on what was the best procedure. It wasn't until many of us had already put our boats away that any kind of concensus seemed to be reached. The last article that I saw in the Fisherman magazine did a test on a product called E-Zorb that was the only one that actually solved the phase separation problem and let gas that had phase separated actually re-combine and be useable again. I just thought I would pass that on and also try to get some answers from everyone as to how they made out this winter. It will be a couple of weeks yet before I test my own boat , so I was kind of hoping to catch a couple of the early birds. I put the additive in all 5 of my tanks , left the metal tanks empty(which I think I'm going to be sorry about doing) and the 3 poly tanks had fuel plus the additive, I'll post the results as soon as I can get to her. I'm sure this is going to be an interesting spring where fuel is concerned.

changeofpace · Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2007 9:42 pm Post subject:

Yeah, I gotta check mine. Kind of been holding off so I could clean up the old girl and give her a new bottom coat and such. I'm off next week and hopefully, the bottom will be painted and the water will be turned on at the club and I can check out the gas and start her up. I'll post what I see soon, I got the pump on the boat, but that last snow and ice storm set me back on my schedule

rebait · Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2007 11:33 pm Post subject:

I have not check mine in the boat yet. As an experiment I kept a couple of gallons that I purchased in November to use in my tractor. No additives or stabilizers were used. I poured a 1/2 gal. in the tractor and it ran fine. Now if I am this lucky with the boats, only time will tell.

John

changeofpace · Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 8:59 am Post subject:

You know John, you might be right, I kept a 5 gallon can in my garage for use in the snow blower, its been sitting there since last fall. When the storms hit last week or so, I filled the snow blower and it was fine. The gas can isnt vented to a wet atmosphere though, so I'll check mine this saturday

leokow · Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:33 pm Post subject:

Somebody needs to pour some of that gas into a container that is clear so that you can see if there's been any type of separation. Pouring some off the top to run your sno blower or lawn mower will only give you a lower octane fuel that's on top, and everything should run fine. It's what's at the bottom that counts. That's where your fuel pick up is drawing the gas from and if it separated all your gonna get is junk in your carb. I'm going to pump out a couple of gallons from each tank into a glass jug so I can see what happened over the winter before it gets into the carbs. I figure to take it from the fitting just before the fuel separator, that way I'll get un filtered fuel straight from the bottom of my tanks.

rebait · Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:34 pm Post subject:

The tank that I used was not vented. The tanks in the boats are vented. The tank on the tractor was vented and the fuel in the tank was good and it was used on and off all winter. I am going to be optimistic.

John

changeofpace · Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:35 am Post subject:

Leo I know you're right about the bottom being the issue, but like John, I'm trying to believe there wont be any problem with the fuel. well at least I have my fingers crossed. We'll both know for sure this weekend one way or the other. I'll post here monday when I get the chance with my results
Terry

leokow · Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 1:51 pm Post subject:

I'm hoping that you are both right , I left my tanks in all different kinds of configurations, with the 2 boats I had 7 tanks to deal with , that's a lot of gas no matter how you slice it,However I did leave the two largest ones empty except for additive and residual fuel and between the other 5 I guess there's about 100 gallons or so to deal with, like you I'll find out about what's up with Overdue this weekend and there's about 40 gal. on her.

changeofpace · Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 3:48 pm Post subject:

time permitting, I'm going down to the boat tonight and drop off some fishing gear I was cleaning and to get some of my tools for a job at home. I hopefully will get some of the gas out of the fuel line going to the seperators and see what they look like. I got to start hauling fuel in before I launch next week and 150 gallons of fuel takes a long time when I can only bring in 15 gallons a trip, 2x 75 gallon tanks, 5 trips each tank to fill Sad

got to find a better way!!!

changeofpace · Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 9:46 pm Post subject:

OK, went to the club tonight. I pulled the fuel lines off the seperators and pumped pure gas out into a glass jar, no water or phase seperation. The club had turned the water on, so I grabbed the fake a lake and 10 gallons of fresh gas and hit the key for the stbd engine. She turned over for about 30 seconds and then fired right up, just like last year. Only a little bit of smoke for 5 - 10 seconds as she cleaned out the last of the mystery oil I dumped in last fall, then she purred like a kitten Smile

Now when I tried to start the port engine Sad

click click click nothing Sad

Had a friend come down and while he was playing with the new battery switch, the port engine fired, We changed the fake a lake over to the port engine and again click click not enough power to start. I know its not the battery switch since the stbd engine gets its power from the same circuit. So its only a bad cable or switch problem.
BEST NEWS IS NO PROBLEM WITH THE GAS Smile

Terry

leokow · Posted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 12:47 pm Post subject:

Hey Terry that's great news, now I can only hope I'll be so lucky as to have it work out that way. I'll let you know Sat . nite.

rebait · Posted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 8:15 pm Post subject:

That is a big relief. I plan on firing up my 18 footer and take a fuel sample from the Wahoo. That is after I change a relief valve on my home's hot water maker. How long can that take - I always expect the worse. I hope my results are as good as Terry's.

John

leokow · Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2007 2:31 pm Post subject:

Sorry it took me so long to post my results from the weekend but I didn't get back to Philly till today (tues.). I worked on overdue this weekend, On this boat I had 2 24 gal poly tanks that were about 1/2 full of fuel before the winter and she stayed in the water all winter. I pumped about a gallon of fuel from each tank and it was perfect a little darker in color but no water and no separation, Then I pulled the separators again nothing but gas and a few specks of junk that the filter collected. I charged the batteries for a couple of hours and she runs just fine, I couldn't have asked for a better start up from the winter. Now I have to finish taking her apart and get over to Our Turn and she what happened on that boat. I hope everyone got thru this miserable winter in the same shape...Leo

changeofpace · Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2007 9:44 pm Post subject:

Started the port engine today and let it run, same as the stbd engine, a little smoke at start up and running great

leokow · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 12:47 pm Post subject:

That's great , Terry, all the wondering over the winter about shelf life and everything else all turns out to be a little bit overblown. But like the old saying, "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure " everything we did surely helped. Ijust hope I make as well on the other boat.
PS just curious...are you going to be able to drive your boat with the camper top on ? Or are you going to have to have it modified before you can use it at all ?OH yeah , one more thing ...where did you find that site with shawn's boat for sale on it ? I lost the e-mail you sent me and I can't get back to it. Talk to you later ...Leo

rebait · Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 6:05 pm Post subject:

My 18' Dixie center console fired right up and that Merc purred like a kitten. The fuel sample looked good. I did not checked the Wahoo yet. I am hoping for the same.

John

changeofpace · Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 9:31 pm Post subject:

First problem with the E10 showed up at my club. Guy had problem with his outboard, couldnt keep the engine running. ended up smoking it. When he pulled the boat the engine had black goo inside

leokow · Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 10:37 am Post subject:

Terry, was it an older boat ? It sounds like hose residue or from a disintegrated diaphram in the fuel pump. It probably started last year and he ran the boat then put it away for the winter with all the gunk in it.
It's really a shame , because all that damage could've been prevented for a few bucks.
PS--I finally got enough stuff out of the way to get to the other end of the steering cable, so I should have it out today.Hope, Hope,Hope!!

changeofpace · Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 4:35 pm Post subject:

Leo, I talked with the guy last night (he was the one who told me about using the clams as bait) He had left about 150 gallons of fuel in the boat from last year. The fuel lines were not the new kind made for gas alcohol mixtures. He had some sitting in a glass jar and it was dark with a black color to it. He was trying to pull the filters off when I came down the dock to see if there was more crud inside them. The engine that was having the problem and ended up smoking sounds horrible, I think he ruined it last weekend. Its hard to start and when it does run, it smokes a lot and wont idle. He is NOT a happy camper. He was wondering why no one knew about this problem. I wanted to ask him where he's been the last year since that was a big topic of conversation last fall when the boats were being pulled. He had his boat moved to his house and spent the winter re-doing the inside over. Now he will have to do the engine over. I plan on squatting in his slip for a while, so hopefully he will take a few weeks to fix the engine. I'm already in my second slip of the season, since I went in on the 7th, this slip is better as its far away from the bridge and now I'm not getting any of the dirt from the highway all over my boat. I was told I would be able to stay there for at least 3 weeks, then would have to move to a different one

leokow · Posted: Wed May 02, 2007 12:23 pm Post subject:

I can't believe that this guy didn't know anything about the ethanol problems, was he in antartica last year or what? It's really a shame , nobody deserves to have that happen to them, but man, it was in every paper ,magazine and marina that you could think of, I guess he just didn't think it would happen to him.
Glad you got a better slip out of it , even if it's only temporary.
I have the entire helm and cable out now, I got the cable out yesterday and today I'm going to try to find a box that'll fit everything and see what it'll cost to get it to you.
I have to take it a little easy today anyway,my back is bothering me a little, I think I did it the other day , I was cutting on the front of the boat and didn't realize a thunder storm was coming in behind me, a bolt of lightening went off, sounded like it was right next to be , but I dropped the sawzall and jumped off the front of the boat. I don't know where it hit for real but it was close enough to fry the radio that was plugged in, plus it scarred the crap out of me !! Good thing I landed in the sand or I probably would have busted a leg or something,I didn't have time to think, just reacted, really caught me by supprise because in front of me the sun was shinning.
I'll let you know what I find out about the shipping.

changeofpace · Posted: Wed May 02, 2007 1:52 pm Post subject:

Leo, Glad you didnt get hurt with the fall and with the storm. This guy seems to not pay attention to anything going on around him or with any discussions about fuel, problems or anything. I saw him again last night and he didnt even seem to remember our conversation when I asked him how were things going with his fuel problem. By the way, his boat is a inboard/outboard, I posted it was an outboard wanted to clear that up.
If the bolt fried the radio, was any other electrical items hurt? Usually the lightning will follow the quickest route to ground, so it might have hit the line the radio was hooked into.
Let me know what the cost for shipping is

leokow · Posted: Wed May 02, 2007 2:10 pm Post subject:

I kind of thought it was an inboard when you said it had a 150 gals. of gas in it and he had redone the interior at home last year . I just chalked it up to the funk you seem to be in lately,LOL..If you don't catch a nice fish soon , I'm going to send you one !....
Only the radio got fried, it probably hit near a wire or transformer somewhere and put a surge into the line, man , that sucker was loud ! and I didn't fall , I jumped ! What an ass, I could have done more damage than the lightening by doing that, but it just really took me by suprise, like I said, the way I was facing it was sunny, I didn't know the black death was closing in behind me, I think I'm going to rig a rear view mirror around my neck so I can see what's comming !!LOL.
Talk to you later...Leo

leokow · Posted: Sat May 05, 2007 8:55 pm Post subject:

Ok, I finally stopped chopping up the old boat long enough to go to Our Turn and check out all the tanks , the 2 57 gal. aluminum tanks that I left empty except for additive were completely free of anything but gas. I put a couple of gals.in each one and pumped it back out and it was perfect, then I tried the 48 poly tank and it was fine , this one I left full with gas and additive, next was the 2 27 gal tanks one was perfect and the other had about 1/2 ounce of water come out of it. I added some e-zorb and I'll see what happenes tomorrow.
So far it looks like both ways of wintering over look to have the same results, wether the tanks are full or empty as long as there is additive in them and no leakage at the fill cap the gas stays clean and fresh for spring. The one poly tank that had a little water was only filled 1/2 way, so that may have been the cause, or it may have been in there before the winter. I have no way of knowing. Overall I'm very satisfied with both additives , Startron and E-zorb.

changeofpace · Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 8:52 pm Post subject:

I saw the guy yesterday and he had some gas in a glass jar and it looks nice and clean. He said the engine runs then quits. When he pulls the carb and takes it apart its filled with goo. I asked him if he had changed his fuel line and he just had a blank look on his face. I told him that the older gas lines wont hold up to the new E10 gas and maybe he should try replacing the fuel line since the gas looks good

Anonymous · Guest

The goo, is exactly what was in my carb's. Very yucky stuff and boy if you let that crap dry your in for a heck of a cleaning project.

I'm having the tank's cleaned on mine. I dont want any concern with residuel goo.

There are alot of boater's who dont have a clue about the ethanol yet. I really think this is going to be a busy summer for alot of boat mechanic's.

leokow · Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 11:51 am Post subject:

I had another guy come over to me the other day while cutting up Overdue, he showed me his fuel and it was clear like you described and he changed his fuel lines, he said. When I went over to the boat to look for him he had only changed the lines from the tank to the separator ! The separator to the carb and the VENT line were still the old type. Everyone forgets that the fuel when it expands runs up into the vent line and back into the tank when it cools down bringing with it the gunk from the inside of the hose. He said he thought only air and fumes went in and out of that line,he didn't remember fuel until I asked him if he ever overfilled his tank , then the light bulb went off over his head. When I asked him about the separator to the carb line he said he thought that wouldn't matter cause he thought most of the stuff would be taken out by the separator.When I explained to him that the material actually disolves into the gas and only resurfaces when the fuel is burned in the engine and then it's too late to fix it, he said no one ever told him that before,and the marina store told him the new separator would take care of everything. I guess even with all talk some people will still be in the dark when it comes to this new fuel. It's a shame a lot money is going to wasted on repairs that would have been un necessary, boats already have a bad enough reputation for costing a lot of money , this isn't going to help any.